You can start by reading the 6th tradition which states: Further the tradition tells us that a related facility is any place involving NA members. It might be a halfway house, a detox center, a counseling center, or a clubhouse. People are easily confused by what is NA and what are the related facilities. Recovery houses that have been started or staffed by NA members have to take care that the differentiation is clear. Perhaps the most confusion exists when it involves a clubhouse. Newcomers and older members often identify the clubhouse with Narcotics Anonymous. We should make a special effort to let these people know that these facilities and NA are not the same. An outside enterprise is any agency, business venture, religion, society, organization, related activity, or any other fellowship. Most of these are easy to identify, except for the other fellowships. Narcotics Anonymous is a separate and distinct fellowship in its own right. Our problem is addiction. The other Twelve Step Fellowships specialize in other problems, and our relationship with them is one of cooperation, not affiliation. The use of literature, speakers, and announcements from other fellowships in our meetings constitutes an implied endorsement of an outside enterprise. This tradition clearly states The use of literature, speakers, and announcements from other fellowships in our meetings constitutes an implied endorsement of an outside enterprise, so if the member continue to violate this tradition show it to them in the literature. Gerald A, Springfield, Illinois LIVING THE DREAM AREA OF NARTOCIS ANONYMOUS
-- Edited by gericang on Sunday 14th of April 2013 06:34:09 PM
what if anything can i do about meetings closing with the lords prayer. there are three meetings in my area that close with that prayer. myself and a few other addicts refuse to circle up with them. weve been thinking about creatating our own circle and close with serenity prayer. but the first tradition tells us unity is a must. and that would show division. are they breaking traditions by doing that. how do we handle it. not trying to control or dictate, only trying to calm the tension and fustration. before it gets out of control. is this solution in the steps or tradtions.
After the basket has come back around: Again, thanks for coming tonight. Would all those who care to, join in a circle to close? Various groups close in different ways: with prayers, brief recitations from NA literature, etc. It up to the group how to close a meeting or as Tradition 2 puts it group conscience.
Tradition Two For our group purpose there is but one ultimate authority a loving God as He may express Himself in our group conscience. Our leaders are but trusted servants; they do not govern.
Tradition Four Each group should be autonomous except in matters affecting other groups or NA as a whole.
For me I join the circle just don't say the paryer. hope this helps. I know this is just my opinion.
When I joined NA over 28 years ago, most meetings closed with the Lord's prayer. Heck, even the serenity prayer can be regarded as a Christian prayer because it was developed by a Christian theologian, Reinhold Niebuhr. Here is the full version:
God, give us grace to accept with serenity the things that cannot be changed, Courage to change the things which should be changed, and the Wisdom to distinguish the one from the other.
Living one day at a time, Enjoying one moment at a time, Accepting hardship as a pathway to peace, Taking, as Jesus did, This sinful world as it is, Not as I would have it, Trusting that You will make all things right, If I surrender to Your will, So that I may be reasonably happy in this life, And supremely happy with You forever in the next.
Amen.
AA and NA groups have used a more secular version of this prayer.
Some groups use the 3rd step prayer from our basic text:
Many of us have said, Take my will and my life, Guide me in recovery, Show me how to live.
In the end I agree, just join in the circle but don't say the prayer if it bothers you.
Perhaps you can bring it up at the group's business meeting.
I know the serenity prayer was written by a Christian but there is nothing in the first stanza, the one WE call the serenity prayer, that implies an adherence to any formal religion. The Lords prayer also does not specifically mention any religion, but whereas the serenity prayer is associated with 12 step programs, the Lords prayer is associated with Christianity. Non Christian addicts coming to the rooms for the first time can use this as a reason to not participate in what could be a life saving activity. AA groups typically close with the Lords prayer and that fellowship gave birth to ours. The steps and traditions are copied virtually word for word from their literature. This is a great topic for discussion. My suggestion to you would be to join this group so you can have a voting voice at the group conscious meetings. If, over the course of time, the character of the group changes then perhaps they will see things in a different way.
All those points are valid points, but the Lord Prayer comes straight from the Bible. It does effect NA as a whole,because we are not giving a clear message. The Tweleve Traditions are not NEGOTIABLE. That was written long before any of us were here, and written for a reason. We can talk about the 1st, 2nd, 3rd traditions all we want, but we need to look at all of the traditions in order to get a clearer understanding.
-- Edited by gericang on Sunday 28th of April 2013 06:51:51 AM
So the serenity prayer is a endorsemant of AA? Came from AA. Like you, I don't like the Our Father at the end of a meeting. because it make the meeting sound to much like AA. meeting.
NA grew up The 2nd edition of the BT was the last time this was in our literature We our deeply grateful to the AA fellowship for pointing the way to a new way of life.
I remember many year ago when this first came up. About the same time that the term he or him was being questioned when talking about God or Higher Power. Isn't that an endorsemant of some kind too. The Higher Power and or God is a man.
As you put it gericang "The Tweleve Traditions are not NEGOTIABLE. That was written long before any of us were here, and written for a reason."
All I can say is For first 30+ years of NA. Meeting ended with the Our Father.
-- Edited by greg1024 on Friday 19th of April 2013 11:49:21 AM
No the serenity prayer IS not an endorsement of any fellowship. However the Lords Prayers is out of the Bible. For our oversea addicts that are in Islamic counties (IE the middle east, in which NA is huge there) they don't believe in the Bible. So my question is if we are a world wide fellowship, why should we use religious materal? Just a question I'm posing. And yes for thirty years NA may have use the Lords Prayer but we have grown as a world wide fellowship.
Ultimately it must be group conscious - for our oversea addicts that are in Islamic countries - will most likely be saying prayers from the Koran, the Al-Fatiha or a Muslim Lords prayer.Both have respect, worship; guidance; and ask for mercy. Sura 2 ... The Al-Fatiha doesn't talk of forgiveness, some other texts in the Quran invite people to forgive.
I don't think it is a good idea to negate any prayer - leave it to group conscious and whether it be a Muslin, Hindu or Judaism, Taoism, Syncretism, (combining African beliefs with Christian beliefs) Agnostic, or Atheist group, and American Indian, or an Aborigine group in Australia - or any of the worlds spiritual prayers, let the group conscious decide. It would be very narrow minded for us, NA members, to determine - only this or that can be said as a prayer.
That' my two cents, thanks for letting me share. Sioux
-- Edited by SIOUX on Saturday 1st of February 2014 10:14:36 AM
-- Edited by SIOUX on Saturday 1st of February 2014 10:21:43 AM
Attend Business meeting, have a polite conversation about it.
See what the Groups conscience is.
If you feel strongly about it and it doesn't go the way you'd like
we can always vote with our feet.
