I'd been there twice before a few months back, really enjoyed the pastor with a great sense of humor and a good message, I went with my ex girfriend who's becoming a christian, and we've been back and forth since and its still not working out.
So anyhow i've had a resentment against religion lately, angry a bit at God, blah blah blah, so i figured I should go again, alone this time and try to listen.
What I heard shocked me a bit this time, and it wasn't like I was looking for the negative I was hoping for something positive. What i heard was self righteous indignation, putting every church and religion down that the pastor could come up with, putting homosexual people down even, yeah because thats what the bible says, the topic of his sermon was " "Deception". And he was pulling covers because he's tired of being silent, he's tired of being considered PASSIVE, he said " we christians are known to be passive but i'm not one of them anymore, so he attacked every damn thing he felt was not christ like out there.
Ok so i'm supposed to find something positive even if its totally negative and I can't, not in his sermon ok other then making he's speaking the truth about a lot of things but what happened to tolerance of others, loving other no matter what they believe or what they do ? I thought that was CHRISTIAN.
I'm not going back guess thats the bottom line, I want nothing to do with that religion, and its christian evangelical, there supposed to be out helping people how do you help people with sucha a hostile negative attitude about everything ?
Its written "For God so loved the world, that He gave His only begotten Son, that whosoever believeth in Him should not perish, but have everlasting life" (John 3:16). Thats as far as my religions going to go and I do believe this, im done with everything else they can have it...
For time immemorial people have been persecuted and wars fought because of Religious Dogmas. Religions for time immemorial have been anything but tolerant of anything and anyone that did not fit their tiny mold of their chosen perception of righteouness. Hypocrasy reigneith.
I truly thank my God NA is a Spiritually based NOT a religious program!
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Work the Steps or Die MF. (My Friend :) Clean One Day At a Time by The Grace of God through The Power of NA
Morning Vin! Yes sir as Mike said"religion" has taken us to many different places not all good.........But many people have asked "what is a real christian, is there a verse in the "Big Book ' of christianity(the Bible)Is a christian one who professes Jesus or knows Christ? Is a christian perhaps someone who is baptized? There is a single verse in the Book that says(Roman 8-14)For as many that are led by the spirit of God ,they are the sons of God(gender inhibiting?)But you are not in the flesh,but in the Spirit ,if so be that then the Spirit of God dwell in you..One either has the "Spirit of God" and is a christian or does not have it and is not a christian. Yes there is a road that follows but each can decide for themselves(they can read ,pray etc,but just like our program we can only carry the message by the actions and deeds of our lives. As in christianity we only carry that message and leave the conviction to that Spirit Of God...Narcotics Anonymous primary purpose is to stay clean ,just for today and carry the message of recovery.I believe our ultimate primary purpose is to be of maximum service to God (of our choosing )and also others. Man is infalliable and yes there are guidelines in all things but wehave a spiritual program,thats focus is remaining God centered and applying the solution " the steps,spiritual principles in our actions and deeds.Like all things ,just for today we have a "process " to work on.I know what the guidelines state but ,for me, my focus is to remain to the best of my ability in a loving and caring manner in all areas of my life,that truly needs to be attended by something greater than this addict..Dont let the resentments from that "man" take you off your spiritual course, God will work in your heart ,but there are other forces working to keep that from you...peace my friend(this is definitely my stuff,aint about no religious thing,I have no religion per se, I have a relationship with a Higher Power whom I choose to call God.I do have specific faith beliefs and am glad to share that as I also carry that message ,I truly work to remain in a spiritual realm in our program as there are many that struggle with "coming to believe" a step necessary in order to achieve ongoing recovery(2nd step).Each must work out there own process in there own way and there own time..I absolutely attend church and take part in service but I also remember that ' where ANY TWO OR THREE ARE GATHERED IN HIS NAME ,there He is with them (Matt 18-20)...Successful recovery is a spiritual state working towards freedom from obsession and compulsion our Basic Test tells us early ,that we suffer from a spiritual illness and that many things have been written about addiction but we will work toward spiritual recovery..Be led by the 'Spirit of God" and for sure 'more will be revealed...... ..........peace my friend!!!
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Our purpose is to remain clean,just for today,and to carry the message of recovery.
hello kelly here. i havent really been too into any religion especially while i was out there using. i have alot of resentment when i think about organized religion, seems like its only about getting money and thats it. but a few months ago i started going back to church and found a real connection this time...with assembly of god its non denominational and i hear the messages without judgements. so maybe your positive message is this find a place that suits you better. also ive been reading a great book called "purpose driven life" written by rick warren. you get a clear and precise message of what Gods purpose means in your daily life...its been working for me and maybe it will work for you...just saying! good luck to you and god bless.
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kelly lofquist
Dont stress over what couldve been, chances are if it shouldve been, it wouldve been...
The Program of Narcotics Anonymous is a 12-Step Program like any other 12-Step Program in the Fellowships Anonymous. When Ive worked 12 Steps and Traditions and try and live the Program, a new dimension opens up; I've connected my human self with the Higher Self called Spirit.
By working the Traditions, I connect my inner life with the outer life.
This way, Ive found my personal point of balance a Neutral Point, where my higher and lower selves and inner and outer lives converge. This Neutral Point is expressed in different ways by each one of us, based on our individual experiences and unique ways of expressing ourselves.
However, irrespective of our personal experiences and unique ways of expressing ourselves, for all of us, the Joy of Being springs from our Neutral Point, our Spirit, from where unconditional love, care, compassion and mercy flow eternally to our physical, ethereal, emotional and mental bodies, and to our Soul.
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Raman an addict clean and serene just for today in NA Worldwide ; live to love and love to live the NA Way !!!
Hey Vin, I'm not surprised that you got a bigoted, hateful message at your church. Not at all. It seems to me that a major theme of all religions is to either hate or at least condemn every other religion. Yeah you hear lip service to 'tolerance' and all that, but diversity, and tolerance are more secular ideas than religious ones. This is the foundation of the power of NA imho....."we are a spiritual, not religious..." The God of your individual understanding is a fundamental right that gives 12 step programs their inate power. Our basic text suggests that your power need only be 'loving, caring, and greater than yourself' and that is enough for me.....My God does not judge or test me...Life will challenge and try me , but my God is always there as my refuge. It's a beautiful thing that works for me.
When I was first introduced to AA I always had a belief in God of the Chuch (Jesus Christ) and I've always went to church. Matter of fact out of High School I went to college to become a minister.
After getting into AA and than later finding out about NA I had to let go of old ideas. I was attending church for awhile after becoming a member of AA/NA but after awhile I stopped going. The people in the Program called me the BT Thumper and a Bible Thumper.
I had a simular experience after becoming a member of NA and I discussed this with my sponsor. My sponsor told me, "Why don't you take your God their to Church?" Well I never thought of that. I did go back for a little while, but in all honesty, I feel much happier after a 12 Step Meeting than I do after going to a church service.
I am pretty sure though that their intentions are good just as ours are, and I am pretty sure that they are helping many people. Sometimes it is really hard to get the whole message or even to find a message. It seemed when I decided to stop going all I was hearing from the Pastor was giving money to the church, 10% of my income, etc. Now I am pretty sure that he was saying a lot more than that, however, that is all that I was hearing.
I don't go to Church anymore. I don't believe either that one would be condemned for not going as I have heard preachers preach. I know that God knows our hearts, and that is what it is all about anyways,
Nice topic.
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Just Keep ON KEEPING ON!!!!!!!!!! If we live we are just pretty lucky
