Morning Raman! I believe you and I have discussed this before.First I want to say that theses are my honest feelings based on my faith beliefs and how I try and walk with the God of my understanding but also remain in reality(without rationalizing,easy to do!!!).Two perspectives I have ,one from being "always" married,one from being basically single.I will also let you know that sexual issues and guilt have alwyas been a big part of keeping me sick since I was a little boy.Probably 50-60% of my 5th and 9th steps involved admitting,forgiving and purging myself of these issues.I am by no means "cured" but definitely God has shown me a way to stay close and not be eaten up with guilt.Similar to our 6th/7th steps I ask God to show me areas of my life that are not pleasing to him and ask to be cleansed of these areas.Until my 3rd marriage(27 years now) I have never been faithful and practised outside of my regular relationships which fueled the guilt.My early faith beliefs always kept me guilt ridden and unable to forgive myself accompanied by drug addiction and further debauchery.I even self satisfied 3-5 times a day trying to quell a tremendous sex drive only a few times matched by women(even during incapacitation,by drugs or alcohol)Today I keep thoughts of my wife in my mind if and when I self satisfy(I am still overly driven)but not to the point that it would take from what my God would call keeping my body holy"This is not about religion as we are a spiritual program and I do not want to give anyone wrong idea here,THIS IS MY STUFF!I try not to "lust in my heart' toward other women and work hard to ask for help when I find myself in that area.I am human and I stumble,but I have found God's grace giving me strength.WHEN i SAY 'WE ARE ALL ONE BAD DECISION AWAY " from devastation part of my thought pattern is in this area as well as drugs.This area is a "drug' for me.Overseas in the Navy for 4 years I had paid sex and was eaten up by guilt.I never went back to that area since 1970 ,when I left the Armed Forces..I am not a minister,or a prude or a sexual predator or remotely cured , I am an addict that suffers from addiction in all areas of my life, but I am finding a "peace in God" that keeps this issue for me way back in my mind and allows me to "have a life".God made sex to be good and enjoyable, I dont believe He would use it to torture us..Our drive comes from Him.As far as you situation with being single,that is a difficult area for me....Even self satifaction(masturbation) would tend to lead  toward lusting in your mind toward others.My spiritual readings tell me it is better to "marry than to burn with lust"!If this was me now I would have to approach it as my abstinence and recovery from drugs and know that I would have to abstain unless married.(could I do that ,ONLY THOUGH GOD).Fortunately I do not have to go there as I am married,but I will pray for your strength,perserverence and freedom ,joy and happiness.Summer is coming,Gods beauty will be inherit in His creations and I will be sorely put to task but with His help I can remain true to placing Him above all else and let the rest trinkle down.I have been as honest as I can be and there was no intent on offending anyone and I do not imply my feelings on anyone elses situation.Go with God today,and all can be well.peace my friend!!

hmmmmm,, all I want is to live and enjoy life without the use of drugs,,,,just for today !

-- Edited by Raman on Tuesday 20th of April 2010 03:38:39 AM

And yes, I was instructed in sex mainly thru the texts i either read or saw,, and they all came from a pornographic viewpoint,,, basically recreational ! 

So that is the attitude Ive had and it felt ok in that phase of my life. But as I go on in years I need to mature in my stance.
 It certainly has taken a lot of effort and guidance in developing a more holistic view of sex !!!
 
I thank God that in NA Ive come to believe that sex is one aspect of expressing love and that sex in itself isnt necessarily love !
Recreational sex is still ok with full consent of both parties involved, but I have stopped expecting it to fullfill my emotional and intimacy needs.

And running after  women that offer the paid variety is a complete no-no.

Oh gosh,, what can that alteration be called ???
SEXUAL SANITY ???



-- Edited by Raman on Thursday 22nd of April 2010 06:37:55 AM

Ha, ha indeed,, I do the shower bit now and then Don. 
The water steamed out few times,,,,heh. hehe,,,


My last relationship was thru internet,, yes it does work. 
There was a long courtship, and the eventual meeting in person.
Was wonderful while it lasted,,, sigh !!
Then the marriage question came up and we seemed ok.
But the Hep.c treatment put paid to dreams and reality suggested we move on.

Now I a free to be me, the reatment is successful and im nearly there physically and mentally.

My next move, as suggested by you is to look in there again. I got some posts this day and oh dear,,,,, one of them is a scientist. The thing now is to send her a mail and get cracking on the dating or spending time together.
 
Im usually attracted to emotional women with whims and fancies. The thrill was in the chase and  in guessing "will she/ wont she !!" 
Was good and fullfiling in that phase of my life but now what ?
I need to make better choices. I need to do something different,,, I suppose a scientist will have a completely different perspective.
 
Yes, Im in anticipation of a good time and have hope. 

But by God,,, i crave the time when I will meet another recovering addict and she and I will be attracted to each other,, a pull that cannot be explained in everyday language and a temptation that cannot be resisted. Simply stated, I believe that one addict can best understand and help another addict,,, even in love and matters of the heart ! 
Yes, by God, I crave that moment !!

And in the meanwhile, I will be honest with whichever other woman comes along,,,,
and if it works out it works out,,,,,,,,hmmmmmmmmm.........

Thanks for letting me share !





-- Edited by Raman on Friday 23rd of April 2010 04:10:12 AM

Have some fun Raman! Love conquers all  Hey nothing like a "good experiment" with a scientist!!!   BE WHO YOU ARE AND  LOVE WILL EXUDE FROM YOU! (i'll have to look that word up:)  peace my friend!

Thanks for that perspective from down under mate,,
hmmmmm,,
I think this relates to what my the sponsor had said
"Practice sexual loving kindness".

Hmmmm,, see it as "think clean" and the loving and serene will naturally happen.

ok out of the closet 8 months ago I stopped using steroids, testosterone specifically and lemme tell you talk about an out of control labido, it was freaken INSANE !!!

I'm not single of again on again with Jenn and there have been a few months without now its sporatic but i find if i keep myself busy it helps and thats been hard since i've been out of work.

I think its time you really kept your peepers on and find a mate/partner/friend/good ol buddy LOL of course let God's will be done in guiding and directing you heh heh...good luck Raman

and yeah,,, these past 18 months, I certainly have missed all the mind-fukking, the heartaches, the joys and blisses and all them games that comes with the chicks.

Like they say " all work and no play makes jack a dull lad" so Id better get back into the dating, cosying, the fun and play.

The bright part is that the hep.c treatment is over and Im cleared of the virus, so no worries on that count.
Then again, in the days of celibacy, Ive gotten real close to God and when discussing chicks with God, the answer has always been the same
" You gotta be un-provoked if u want any success with the chicks (women) pal,,,,".

So I took up Meditation more seriously than before with the aim of being like a rock,,,under even the gravest of provocations.
I also discovered that sex was actually a very strong secondary addiction,,gosh Id certainly qualify for sex-addicts anonymous,, where they say they share their sex-periences,,,ha,ha,ha, just kidding !

My prayer, over and over again is
" Relieve me of the bondage of self and build with me and do with me as THOU WILT !!!"

And so be it,,, just for today !

and yeah,,, these past 18 months, I certainly have missed all the mind-fukking, the heartaches, the joys and blisses and all them games that comes with the chicks.


Yeah well once you get into the groove you won't miss it LOLOLOL.....

yeah,,, sure ,, im eager to get into the groove ,, heh, heh,,

A post taken from my friends website,, tha's given me new perspective on my secondary addiction.


"Many people pursue recovery as a quest for knowledge. They judge the value of a seminar, book, or meeting based on how much new information they picked up. If they dont hear anything new, they tend to feel let down, as though it wasnt worth their time.

The implicit assumption is that learning leads to progress: the accumulation of new knowledge brings you further along the path. Being exposed to a new concepts is often seen as learning something if we can understand and grasp these new ideas, we feel like were moving forward.

Not necessarily.

What really matters is the process of translating that concept into tangible action. The learning of recovery involves not just storing more facts in our heads it means acquiring new knowledge that changes who we are (including how we live).

As is often stated in recovery meetings, this is a program of action. The problem we must overcome in recovery is not new knowledge acquisition it is execution. Our problem is not that we dont know enough the problem is that we dont act on what we know.

This is manifest in the tendency we have to learn new things about recovery, start to apply them, and then shortly thereafter, move on to some other new insights, some other new approach, and start acting on those ideas. Meanwhile, we stop doing the things we had started to do at first, because weve jumped to a new set of priorities and actions.

When people get slippery in their behaviors and/or have slips, it pretty much always come down to this: they have stopped doing the fundamentals. They drift away from key practices that they identified as key positive steps to help them in their recovery (going to meetings, making calls, engaging in open conversations with their spouse, engaging in spiritual practices, etc). Alongside of this, they have likely started compromising some of the middle circle behaviors things that are not necessarily breaking sobriety, but are unhealthy and feed our addictive tendencies (surfing around on the computer, isolating, harboring resentment, engaging in harmless flirting, etc.).

Put very simply the issue is this: our problems in recovery usually dont stem from things we dont know our problems stem from things we already know, but arent putting into action. Therefore the solution is probably not learning more stuff (going to workshops, seminars, counselors, and reading books and blogs looking for new and novel ideas about recovery). The solution is putting our knowledge - however limited - into action. So we do the things mentioned above (the workshops, books, etc) with the hope that they will motivate and inspire us to act on what we already know."
Mark