Okay gang please point it out, is it the basic text? The IP's? Where? I will tell you why........
When I was using I had no boundries. You know how it says before coming to NA we were sick people? Well I was lucky enough NOT to have been arrested because quite frankly mentally I dont think I could have handled jail.......Towards the end though and I knew it I was awefully close....
For real doing deals in bathrooms with crroked nosers with guns etc...and that my brothers and sisters for me about me WAS SICK AND DANGEROUS!~
Now I have 9 months and 20 days and I know that is still babytime but it is my time, and I am working the steps, I do have a sponsor, I am a trusted servant, GSR, call mynetwork of my NA family etc....
But to tell you the truth I realize there are people who say they are clean they announce they have 11 days...50 days and you find out they are hitting the crack pipe or banging dope......I cant trust openly everyone....
I cant LOVE EVERYONE I had people like 30 in my house for dessert after a meeting one night and 2 of my cameras were missing!
I told my sponsor, but that was it....she thinks the love thing is part of our principles H.O.W.
What do you all think? I dont even feelbad for not loving everyone either!
My husband gave a guy a ride home because he needed it and after a meeting he said yeah you can dropme off at my crackdealer... He was an ass and I wont allow him back in our car and I DEF DONT EVEN LIKE THIS JACK ASS ANYMORE!
How funny that you posted this. My sponsor and I were just talking about this very subject the other day. I too have a hard time with the love everybody concept.
My sponsor told me, that it's more of an action then a feeling.
As for letting just anyone into my home.....well, no. My home is my serenity. I don't care who you are, if I don't trust you, I'm not going to be handing out an invite to my home.
I will hug you when you come into the rooms of NA. I will hug you on the streets. I will listen to you, I will show you the respect that I hope you would show me and with time, I will begin to trust you and then the action will turn into a feeling of Love.
I don't know if its really a " love " everybody as much as its an " accept " everybody. We try to practice tolerance towards our fellow addicts and accept them for what they are. Some as you have found out, are sicker than others. Do I trust everyone in the program ? Hell no. Does that make my program weak ? Hell no. As we get cleaner we accept life on its terms, We accept responsibility for our own actions. And in turn we expect others to do the same. Some do. and some don't. We can only be responsible to ourselves. Part of the responsibility of taking care of us is to trust instincts that may not be entirely broken by our using. I think addicts in general have a pretty good sense of who's bad and who's ok. We get ripped off on occasion , but overall , we know. I spoke to an older member who knew I was struggling with this issue. The " love everyone" part of spirituality does NOT say let every person make a schmuck of you. We are not poor little waifs that let everyone run us over. At least not anymore. Thanks for putting this out honey Bear. Its a great topic that touches on the day to day living of our new spiritual life. Im looking forward to what some of our more learned old timers say about it.
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The fundamental delusion of humanity , is to suppose that I am here and you are out there .
Hey guys, I think when we talk about love its more about compassion for the still suffering addict. I cant afford to forget where I came from, the things I did, the people I hurt, the harm I caused to everone around me. Most of all the sense of no self worth that all these behaviors caused me to feel as sank deeper and deeper into the hell of active addiction. Through our inability to exept personal responsabilities we where accually creating our own problems. Having said that I absolutly agree that I must without fail do my best to keep my recovery and my home a safe place. I have to be very careful about who I alow into my space. I have to learn to love some people from a distance. Wich means I have to keep some people at a distance. Sometimes I just have to love me.
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It sure is eazier to get through the moment than it is to get through the aftermath.
Great thread, Honey Bear. I can only share my understanding and experience and it's not real simple, so please try to bear with me.
For me, recovery is about spiritual growth. Step one in IWH&W talks about how "...our future depends on our willingness to grow spiritually." The core of the disease is self-obsession- that extreme self-centeredness. Working the steps and living a life based in spiritual principles facilitates spiritual growth that moves me along a path away from the self-centeredness of the disease toward God-centeredness and service to others. For a long time I thought that Spiritual growth was the goal, simply for these reasons. As I kept coming and growing my understanding changed. Today, I believe that the reason spiritual growth is vital is that I MUST learn how to love. If anyone had asked me when I got here if I loved myself, I would have said, "of course." The reality was that I didn't even know what love was. How could I love myself and continue to try to destroy myself with dope? And if I couldn't love me, I most certainly couldn't love anyone else. The reason I belive that Love is the Ultimate Goal of step work and all Spiritual Growth is because that's what step 12 is ALL about. When I carry this message to addicts, I'm truly loving others. When I practice these principles in all my affairs, I'm truly loving myself. No, I don't believe that "Love" means that I trust every addict I meet and allow them access to my home, family, and resources. But for me, what it does mean is that I try not to judge too harshly and try to "practice" compassion, tolerance, patience, and understanding for that still suffering addict. As has been mentioned practice doesn't necessarily mean "feel." If I ACT compassionate, I will TREAT that person with compassion, even if I don't FEEL it. Compassion makes it possible for me to love the person, but not their behavior.
Please keep in mind that this is just one addicts point of view. I encourage you to keep growing, keep asking questions, and above all, keep working steps, for by this you will come to your OWN understanding. Again, thanks for the post and thanks for letting me share.
P.S.--The twelve basic spiritual principles outlined in step 12 of the text includes "unconditional love, caring and sharing." Caring can be the passive expression of unconditional love, and sharing the active expression.
-- Edited by dan h at 00:47, 2008-12-11
-- Edited by dan h at 00:50, 2008-12-11
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"With a sweet tongue of kindness, you can drag an elephant by a hair." ~Persian Proverb
Some where it does say we have to let the family of NA love us until we can start loving ourselves, it's a process I have found myself in I did not know how to truly love anyone or anything including myself when I came here, I am begining to learn and understand just what it takes to love myself and in turn love others, but I'm just a mean SOB and its taking a long time .
I let an injured friend I called my brother stay in my home. I did so much for him. I was thanked by missing jewelry, money missing out of my mtg treasury, money missing from sisters kids, empty baggies in my trash, my bathroom candles distroyed, oh and my kids father right along with him both tweeking in my house. I kicked them both out. I love you. But from a distance. I will not put my recovery or my home at risk.
I red a beautiful proverb in an ashram once . It read LOVE ALL AND SERVE ALL . This simply means to me that as I grow spiritually there will always be place for more love and more service. Yes I also few experience sin recovery where in trying to help out another suffering addict i was left with backbiting,missing money, conned money and slander. I was initially hurt but later on came to believe that what i thought was helping was actually the disease runnning my life. I was actually trying to control these addict thinking that I could lead them in the right direction. Even thats not a bad motive,,simply didnt work because I wasnt a good example of selfless love and unexpecting service myself. I now believe in an adage that its good to give only until it hurts. If the giving/sharing is hurtin me,hurting the other or both then thats got to stop,rigt now. We are asked in the 10th Step Inventory if we gave of ourself without expecting anything in return ? And that I believe is a measure of how far I can give.i have to give till I begin to expect,and obviously I cannot give what I myself havent got. To live is to love and I feel very good about the attitude to love all and serve all as far as it goes. WhenevEr Ive lived out that motto,,IVE HAD FULLFILLED,SATISFYING,SERENE DAYS,,
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Raman an addict clean and serene just for today in NA Worldwide ; live to love and love to live the NA Way !!!
And Shannon,,thanks for starting this fab thread. In fact the other day,God put me in a place where I saw ideals ibecome action. The scene is like this= Im coming out of the building after seeing my marks in a certain paper. Ive just failed. I am hurt,angry and confused. My hate is directed towards the lecturer who I found boring,tight lipped and tricky. Well that afternoon as I come out of the building there he stands. He sees me and says "Thanks for coming to the lecture". There had been only 10 of 150 in that lecture,,obviously a boycott. I say "Thats all right". That sentence had nothing to do with how I was feeling then but it set me right too. I believ that was a response based on Intutive Goodness and empathy. In that exact moment<id forgiven and also understood that theres always chances to catch up in the next exam and not fuss over or be obssessed about the failure.
You know the thing about the two dogs.? Ones called hate and the other is called love. Both are big,well built good-line dogs. the difference is that hate looks really scary,,mouth dripping with saliva,,red bloodshot eyes etc. Love looks tough ,well muscled, and solid. but theres an innate air of serenity there. The one that I feed grows and I may well not be able to feed both. the most important thing is in feeding the Love-dog,,I can be certain that love wont turn against me but think of the hate dog,,I can feed it well, and get it to be more mean,scary etc. but can i be sure Hate wont want to devour me too or devour me first ? This Program reminds me that I have real choices ,,just for today I choose the path of love and affection.
-- Edited by Raman at 05:41, 2008-12-14
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Raman an addict clean and serene just for today in NA Worldwide ; live to love and love to live the NA Way !!!
If you think how low an addict must be to take advantage of your kindness and generosity, then they truely are in need of help. Prayers and kind thoughts, yes. Trust....maybe not!
There's a young man who attends my home group, and he's really down on his luck. He's been staying rent free with others, and it's time for him to move on. Whereas i pray he recieves god's will, and the strenght and courage to carry that out, I don't trust him enough to offer him my spare bedroom.
Kind of reminds me of the coffee lock box, and the rent's drop safe in the AA meeting house we rent space in. They have probably learned from experience to keep that away from anyone temptation to steal...
I love all addicts....however i do not like them all....love is very different from liking someone and letting them up in your home. Love is one of our spiritual principals. ((hugs))) JudyO
In fact yes,, id say I love all addicts too,,,wherebver they maybe and all them that I have encountered. Ok,,but I dont like most of em coming home, I dont like lending em money(always a bad experience) I dont like many of the things they do,,( too many to mention without losing love for them ) I dont like to teach them or preach them the Steps. And yes,,I live em all,,whatever shape size background. And yes,,,MY LOVE IS COLOUR BLIND!!!!!
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Raman an addict clean and serene just for today in NA Worldwide ; live to love and love to live the NA Way !!!