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Post Info TOPIC: Defects of character/ Shortcomings


Member

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Defects of character/ Shortcomings


Someone once told me what the difference was between shortcomings and defects of character. They put it in a very succinct way and it sounded like an N.A saying so I was wondering if anyone knows it and id not can someone please explain it to me?

Thanks

Hemi



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Guru

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Hi  ....reading steps 6 and 7as written, I believe our character defects and our shortcomings are the same thing.

soberrecovery.com has a 2 page thread on this-here's a snippet from that discussion:

Quote:
Someone once told me that defects are (attitudes) and if left unchecked they bring about our shortcomings (behavior).
Reply:

That's exactly the kind of "old-school" misinformation I was referring to. When I got clean, there were a lot of members sharing basically the same thing: that a character defect was one thing (mental) and a shortcoming was another (an action). This view insists that a defect of character creates or causes a shortcoming. Our literature makes no such distinction.

The Just For Today reading on the subject of Step 6 is on page 136, and shortcomings and defects are mentioned. It states, As we let go of our shortcomings and find their influence waning, well notice that a loving God replaces those defects with quality attributes.

Take note that the book says, those defects, leaving you an answer in the same sentence, our shortcomings that we let go. As throughout our literature two words, same meaning. And if you noticed, the reading talks about letting go of shortcomings, whereas the Basic Text uses the term defect in regard to something that should be let go. Basic Text, page 33 states, Letting go of character defects should be done decisively.

One of the most important statements in our literature to illustrate that defects and shortcomings are the same (causative) is the first line of Step 7 in the Basic Text:

Character defects or shortcomings are those things that cause pain and misery all of our lives

I could go on...but I found it important for me to know why I "act out" and when I pray, I pray to have the cause removed...thus addressing any action that results.

grouphug5vj5.gif
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"One Promise, Many Rewards."

(end of the post )



-- Edited by LeeU on Thursday 11th of June 2009 06:47:06 PM

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From dying and surviving to living and thriving. LeeU


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they're the same, it was just the authors attempt not to sound repetitive, because otherwise steps 6 and 7 would sound to much alike.

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You know that old joke about a sponsee asking the sponsor
"Whats the differance between defects and shortcomings ?"
The sponsor is quick to reply
"Well I still have defects, but you are a shortcoming !"

Thats supposed to be funny, but theres a message of recoverey embedded in that !

After Lee has fabulously referred to the Basic Text, I now look at the Green and Gold;
"the spiritual life ceased to be a theory we hear in meetings"(pg. 71)
Then in Step 6
"We will not however acheive a state of spiritual perfection no matter how dilligently we apply the Sixth Step in our lives".

Then Im reminded that an addict like me will most probably feel devastated when an old defect that I thought was gone away forever suddenly reappears.

What has happened in my life ? What theory diod i gain from the ground of those experiences and occurances that obviuosly were a result of the defects cropping up and playing havoc in my life ?

The second section of the first Step deals with the disease manifesting even without drugs !
Is that a clue ? Dosent the disease actually manifest through defects ?

I believe that defects are basically manifestations of shortcomings; a different way of describing addiction ;if one can take that viewpoint based on theory gained from ones experience in recovery, especially when what I think wree defects of charatcer , were running my life!
In effect, it seems like shortcomings are the disease of addiction and defects are the manifestations in ones life of that destructive , dishonest powere greater than ourselves !

I hold close the belief that shortcomings are the source of character defects. In order to not be controlled by defects, I need to address the source of dis-ease; self-centred fear !

Having said that, the Seventh Step reads (pg. 74) that with this knowledge comes freedom; though an addict like me is never cured of the disease or of defects, the next time they come my way, I have a choice; either to wallow in tose defects and set myself up for more trouble or simply move away from them !

Had a small incident happen this afternoon that illustrates my point=
I was on this road having parked my car, in what I thought was quite a safe place.
Then seeing a "NO PARKING FOR 100 FT." board i decided to move the car away and found another spot so I got my car here.
Now as Im backing up, I see this chick come across my vision and thats when, in retrospect, I stopped concentrating on the road.
\I was instead looking at her,, then it happens; I hear a crunch and whne I get out to see, theres a scrape.
Im @#$%^&* angry at myself for being an idiot and repeating thisd same mistake Id done many times before;
I was angry at that chick, that anonymous stranger who came in my field, and then it strikes me that If i go on with that train of thought , Im going to be wallowing in that defect and cause myself more harm.

So I tell myself
"@#$% it" and move on.
Later analyss shows that Ive been careless in my driving before that even, and this is a consequence of that and not something that just happened !
Today, Im glad I have a choice,,,Just for today I never have to stay in defects of character and let my life becme living hell.
Just for today my thoughts will be on my recovery, living and enjoying life without the use of drugs !

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Raman an addict clean and serene just for today in NA Worldwide ; live to love and love to live the NA Way !!!


Newbie

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The longer I work a program of recovery the more I understand how my intellect can cloud my ability to accept the spirituality of the principles. That is why they have to be a verb and not a noun in my life.

Shortcoming: Neglect of, or failure in, performance of duty
Defect: A fault or malfunction
Character: A moral strength

My personal ESH

We become entirely ready to have God remove our defects of character: This is talking about what I do, not what God does... i.e. the question: Does God ever really remove my defects of character? is not a question our literature attempts to answer. What our literature addresses is the condition of our heart. We become entirely ready to let go of those defects and learn to practice a new way of life. We turn to a loving and caring power greater than ourselves for help.

We humbly ask God to remove our shortcomings: I have tried my entire life to be a better person, but failed (shortcoming). I failed because I tried to do it on my own power and in my own self centered and fearful ways. I now do something different and ask my loving and caring Higher Power to do it with me as I accept and surrender to this new way of life.
I do my best in my actions and where I fall short in the course of my life (day), I depend on my Higher Power to do for (with) me what I cannot (alone). That part that my Higher Power does (turning defects into assets) is the part that would have been my shortcoming had I tried to do it without my Higher Powers loving care.


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That's a nice insight there,,,,, thank you.
That,s wisdom to know the difference there,, your definition of shortcoming, defect and character has set me a new standard in understanding of self, God and Spiritual inquiry.

IMHO,,, because this is a spiritual program, I am allowed to question concepts use the faculty of critical thinking to arrive at inferences as to what works in terms of letting go of those forces that play havoc in my life !!!

Yeah,, they say ego =
E,, edging
G,, God
O,, out !~

Recommended tactics=
G,,, great
O,,, out
D,,, doors

and asking for
G,,, good
O,,,orderly
D,,,direction ~!

Yeah,, being Higher Powered is always a better feeling than self-driven,,,,,,,but,,but,,,

(Sigh,,,) I wish I knew how to be God centred 24 hours a day,,hehhehheh !!

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Raman an addict clean and serene just for today in NA Worldwide ; live to love and love to live the NA Way !!!


Guru

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But hey, hey,hey,, 
my experience of this day shows that I dont know how to look at chicks,,hahaha,,, nor does it seem like Im in a hurry to ask God to ignore chicks completely !
 
I laugh at myself !!!
Tthis day, having driven about 150 miles to be in this Meditation place, I quickly get into the routine. 
The first thing is the 10 mile walk. 
Then the common Prayer and Worship.
Next is Meditation. 
Prayer and Worship are collective, while walking and Meditatrion are solo. 
This imples that when Im in Meditation I must completely focus on me first ; then hand that over,,, alll the (what I thnk) good and bad, and ask for Light !
 
However there i was, also getting off that focus and loking to see what others were doing. Most others in that Meditation room that i took reference from were women. 
Nothing has ever gladdened my heart more to this day than  looking at a woman deep in Meditation,,,
what a boon to sit there and look , observe, analyse ( pon the theory of the 12 Steps of NA) and get a perspective for me,,, in my recovery ! 
Ive come to believe that this watching , (if no staring si involved) is an important part of character formation,,, willingness to learn from oitrhers experiences. 

You know ? The old proverb which goes like this=
"Wise are they that learn from experience, but, wisest are them that learn from OTHER'S EXPERIENCES !" 
Oh God,,, Guide me on,,, letting me remember that God is infalliable while me, a human is prone to error !

-- Edited by Raman on Thursday 18th of June 2009 12:22:39 PM

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Raman an addict clean and serene just for today in NA Worldwide ; live to love and love to live the NA Way !!!


Senior Member

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10 MILE WALK OH MAN I'D NEVER MAKE IT THERE bleh

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It's all about spirituality...


Guru

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The point is to take that walk as soon as one gets here.
And I got here at 12 midnite, driving for four hours.
I just wanted to stop walking at times but had to move on,,,
with just two breaks to sit down and sip tea t the all nite stalls along the way !

People from all over the world come here to do this,,

This is the warmest time of the year and only the most devoted stay back,,,
after lunch at the ashram and now this emailing,,im back to the ashram to do a long Meditation .

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Raman an addict clean and serene just for today in NA Worldwide ; live to love and love to live the NA Way !!!


Guru

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Maybe the walking is one way of acting opposite of the defect of laziness,,,
I wopuld consider any thoughts to the contrary as shortcomings embedded in my thinking,,

"f@#$ this"
"whats the benefit ?"
and thoughts like
"this i @#$%^& ridiculous" on a lonely raod at 2 in the morning,,,
"this is madness, sint there some easier way of overcoming laziness ?"
are examples of shotrcomiongs embedded in my thinking.

Like a computer virus that misguides the system,,,,

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Raman an addict clean and serene just for today in NA Worldwide ; live to love and love to live the NA Way !!!


Member

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mmmmnope, I thought someone might know it but it hasn't been brought up. It was a kindof funny sayng but very true at the same time.

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If I want gold I am going to have to WALK FOR IT LOL

So theres definitely some pay off to working for something, may its the trip and what you get from the journey. I know when I am driving to gold spots I often let my mind open and wander find myself meditating and in prayer before I know it.

I know some guys who put a lot into getting equipment into a spot that no one else was willing to go to, guess what they hit the mother lode, and yes I am jealous cause I dont like one of the guys he is arrogant and selfish but he worked for it and now its paying.


I got off the subject I am OBSESSING in ANGER LOLbleh


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It's all about spirituality...


Guru

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ha,ha,, way to go Vin,,lucky strike ahead buddy,,keep coming back to it !

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Raman an addict clean and serene just for today in NA Worldwide ; live to love and love to live the NA Way !!!


Guru

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And which saying may that be Hemi ??
Im eager to hear it !

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Raman an addict clean and serene just for today in NA Worldwide ; live to love and love to live the NA Way !!!
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